Program#L7The Theological Adventures of Johnny Lukewarm andPastor Loophole: Faith vs. Works
Radio Show Transcript, © 2001, Persuade TheWorld Ministries, Gordon James Klingenschmitt, Servant. Copyingand distribution (without editing) is highly encouraged.
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Opening introduction by MarkMcWilliams
Welcome and thank you for joining this radiobroadcast of Persuade The World Ministries. Youreabout to hear our radio production of the book written and taughtby Gordon James Klingenschmitt, entitled License To Sin,The Number One Reason America Is Losing Its MoralFoundation. If you call us in the next hour,well mail you a free cassette tape of todaysbroadcast, which you can copy and give to your friends. Justcall our toll-free phone number: 866-Obey-God. Thatstoll free, 1-866-O-B-E-Y-G-O-D. Gordon JamesKlingenschmitt is a graduate of the United States Air ForceAcademy, and a seminary graduate of
Thanks Mark. Today we continue ourmini-drama entitled The Theological Adventures of JohnnyLukewarm and Pastor Loophole. You may remember ourcharacters, Johnny Lukewarm, and Pastor Loophole from our lastbroadcast. But before we re-introduce these two characters,lets read again from 2nd Timothy chapter 3. For the time will come when men will not put up withsound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, theywill gather around them a great number of teachers tosay what their itching ears want to hear. Theywill turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside tomyths. People often turn to counselors who tellthem what their itching ears want to hear. As is the casewith our character, Johnny Lukewarm, who comes into PastorLoopholes office to get advice
(Lower) Please have a seat, Johnny. What seems to bebothering you today?
Johnnys brow furrows with concern. (Higher)Pastor Loophole, Im very upset about this particularpassage of scripture. It seems as though God is commandingme to do something I really dont want to do. Do Ireally have to repent, and stop sinning, and obey God? Oris there some other alternative?
(Lower) Why, certainly there is, Johnny, you just relax. I can offer you dozens of alternatives, and give you very logicalreasons why you dont have to obey God.
(Higher) Oh, thank goodness. For a minute there, Ithought Id actually have to change my behavior and obeyGod! Johnny breathes a sigh of relief. He sitsforward eagerly, with his itching ears searching for some way ofescape from the Holy Spirits conviction. But theSpirit of God is grieved away, and He slowly withdraws hisconviction from Johnnys life.
(Start) Nowlets continue on Loophole #4, as Pastor Loophole re-definesthe words salvation, grace, faith and works:
(Lower) Johnny, it says here in Ephesians chapter two,For it is by grace you have been saved,through faithand this not fromyourselves, it is the gift of Godnot by works,so that no one can boast.
(Lower) Nowlets re-define the word faith. Faith just meansmental assent, or believing or trusting in certain statements offact. This is the only requirement of salvation: justbelieve that Jesus Christ died on the cross to forgive your sins. If you personally and sincerely trust in this fact alone, Johnny,something magical happens. It becomes real. Youreforgiven of your sins, even while you continue to enjoy thosesins! You dont have to submit to the Lordship ofJesus Christ, or to let Him rule your heartjust believeyoure forgiven and that makes it true. If you justbelieve one single fact, that Jesus forgives your sins, then youdont have to repent or forsake those sins. Nothingelse is required. Were saved by faith alone, Johnny. Faith alone.
TIME OUT !! Lets look at thescriptures everybody, and analyze Pastor Loopholes advice. Lets rightly divide the word of truth, and separate thetruth from the lies in the advice given by Pastor Loophole. First, I want to acknowledge the true part. Its truethat It is by grace you have been saved,through faithand this not fromyourselves, it is the gift of Godnot by works,so that no one can boast.
But the lie is that faith means mental assent to certain facts. But heres the truth: Genuine faith doesnt just meanyou believe youre forgiven, genuine faith meanswhole-hearted submission to the Lordship of Jesus Christ. Thatssaving faith.
Most Christians know that were saved bygrace
But what exactlydoes that mean, to believe in the Lord Jesus? Does it meanyou believe God exists, or that Jesus was a real person and agood moral teacher and even the Son of God? Well justbelieving in Jesus like that isnt enough to get you saved,because even the demons believe thatand shudder.
So what does itmean to believe in Jesus? Does it mean you believe He diedon the cross to pay the penalty for your personal sins? Orthat He rose from the dead? What if you even verballyconfess him as Lord with your own lips? Is that enough toget you saved? Jesus says in Matthew 7, Many willsay to me on that day, Lord, Lord.....Then I willtell them plainly, I never knew you. Away from me,you evildoers!
Well, lets look at somebody who had more faith in Christthan anybody in all of Israel. Do you remember the RomanCenturion in Matthew chapter 8? Jesus said nobody in Israelhad as much faith as that one Roman Centurion. Jesus saidhis faith was genuine. So what did his faith look like? Do you remember? The centurion said, Lord, I do notdeserve to have you come under my roof. But just say the word,and my servant will be healed. For I myself am a man underauthority, with soldiers under me. I tell this one,Go, and he goes; and that one, Come, andhe comes. I say to my servant, Do this, and he doesit. When Jesus heard this, he was astonished and saidto those following him, I tell you the truth, Ihave not found anyone in Israel with such great faith
Now Jesus defined genuine faith here. Did you get it? Look closer. Faith means recognizing the authority of thespeaker, and submitting to Him. The centurion submittedhimself to Christs authority. In effect, he said,Jesus, you have authority over all things. You rankso highly, that everybody must obey you, so I also submit to yourauthority. This centurion had genuine faith, thegreatest faith in all Israel. Thats the differencebetween those who are saved and those who are going to hell. Saved people submit to the authority of Jesus Christ. Butunsaved people refuse to do that. Even the devil believesin God, but he wont submit to Gods authority. Thedevil has faith, but not saving faith, because he wont letGod rule his heart. So you listening on the radio, let meask you a question. Do you believe in God, while you refuseto let God rule your heart? If God doesnt rule yourheart, you dont have saving faith. Youre notsaved. And when God throws the devil into hell, God willalso throw you into hell. But its not too late. Invite God to come and rule your heart, right now. Submityourself to Christs authority, like the Roman Centuriondid. He had the greatest faith in all of Israel, because helet Jesus rule his heart.
Now to everybody out there listening, let me give two goodreasons why you oughtta submit your heart to Christsauthority. 1.) He Loves You. and 2.) Hessmarter than you. Think about that for a second. Whydoes Jesus want you to submit yourself to his authority? BecauseHe loves you and because hes smarter than you.
When a mom and dad send their preschoolers outside, they sayDont play in the street! But why are momand dad so demanding? Are they mean-spirited, selfish,controlling people? No! Theyre just concernedfor their kids safety. 1.) They love em. and2.) Theyre smarter than the preschoolers are. Theyknow it might be dangerous to play in the street. Now inthe same way, when God says Dont be sexuallyimmoral. Dont worship false Gods. Keep holy theSabbath day.whys God so demanding? Well,hes looking out for your safety. Submit yourself toGod. God loves you and hes smarter than you are.
Now the Apostle James wrote about two kinds of faith: LivingFaith, and Dead Faith. So Johnny Lukewarm, if yourelistening out there, I agree you have faith, but is your faithalive or is it dead?
Lets read from James 2: What good is it, mybrothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Cansuch faith save him?
faith by itself, if it is notaccompanied by action, is dead
You believe that there is oneGod. Good! Even the demons believe that andshudder
faith without works is dead
Was not Abraham ourfather justified by works
faith wrought with his works, andby works was faith made perfect
a person is justified bywhat he does and not by faith alone
As the body without thespirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.
So let me ask you,is your faith dead, or is it alive? You know if your faithis dead, it can never save you from hell?
Now from thesescriptures, lets properly define the word Believe: Tobelieve in the Lord Jesus means to submit your heart to therulership of the Lord Jesus or To bow your knee tothe authority of the Lord Jesus or To worship theLord Jesus with all your heart and mind and soul Thatswhat it means to believe in the Lord Jesus.
Submission toChrists authority is the only difference between those whotruly believe in Christ and are saved and going toheaven, and those who claim to believe in Christ butare not saved and are not going to heaven.
You know, if yourefuse to submit your heart to Christs rulership,youre an unbeliever. You dont believe in theLord Jesus, because you dont want Him to rule your heart. If this is you, dont call yourself a Christian. Faithmeans submission to Christs authority. But ifyouve never invited Jesus to come and rule your heart,youre still an unbeliever. If Christ is not yourLord, then hes not your Savior either. If Christ isnot your Lord, you have no saving faith.
Lets pray together. Would you to just stop whatyoure doing for a moment, and pray with me to God? Justpray these words to God with me. Father in heaven, Iconfess that my faith has been hollow, and shallow, andworthless, because I havent submitted my heart to yourauthority. I havent really believed in you, because Ihavent invited you to come and rule my heart. But Iwant to change that now. I repent, Lord, and I submit myheart to your authority. Come and rule my heart now, LordJesus, and take over every part of my life. Im not myown boss anymore. Lord Jesus, you are my boss from now on. I submit to your rulership right now. I receive yourforgiveness of my sins, and I thank you in Jesus name,Amen. Did you just pray with me? If you prayedwith me, say Amen. Go ahead and say it out loud. Amen. Now if you just said Amen, I want you to write to me and get acopy of this book youre hearing me teach from. HeresMark with that information.
Middle segment by Mark McWilliams
Thanks Gordon. Hell be back injust a moment. But first, do you know somebody who needs tohear todays message? If you call our toll-free numberin the next hour, 866-Obey-God, well mail you a freecassette tape of todays broadcast, which you can copy andgive to your friends. All our tapes are copyable and free,but please remember we need your donations to stay on the air andto give away these free tapes. So please pray and obey,then send us your best possible donation, after you receive yourfree cassette. (Gordon: Hey time out! Ifits your first time calling us, no donation is required! Just call us!) Our toll free number is 866-Obey-God,thats 1-866-O-B-E-Y-G-O-D. And please specifyyoure requesting todays program. Do you believeAmerica needs to hear these messages? If so, then we needyou to sponsor us, by joining the Persuaders Club with amonthly pledge of just $15. If you join thePersuaders Club, well also send you an autographedcopy of Gordons book that youve been hearing. Justvisit our web-site at persuaders-club.com. Or call us inthe next hour at 866-Obey-God. Right now, lets returnto Gordon James Klingenschmitt.
Thanks, Mark. Now lets continue with Loophole #4, as Pastor Loopholere-defines the words salvation, grace, faith and works:
(Lower) Johnny,lets re-define the word works. This is veryimportant. Were not saved by good works, Johnny. In fact, things like repentance and holiness and love andsubmission to Gods authority, those are just good works,Johnny. And good works are optional when it comes tosalvation. So you dont have to repent, or be holy,and you can still go to heaven! You dont have to loveGod or submit to Gods authority, and God still forgivesyou, even while you continue to enjoy your sins. After all,were not saved by good works, Johnny, were saved byfaith alone. Just believe youre forgiven, faithalone.
TIME OUT !! Lets go back to thescriptures everybody, and analyze Pastor Loopholes advice. Lets rightly divide the word of truth, and separate thetruth from the lies in the advice given by Pastor Loophole. Again, I want to acknowledge the true part. Its truethat It is by grace you have been saved,through faithand this not fromyourselves, it is the gift of Godnot by works,so that no one can boast.
But the lie is that holiness is the same as good works, or lovingGod is the same as good works, or submitting your heart to theauthority of Christ is the same as good works. Thatsa lie! But heres the truth to replace that lies:Holiness and submission and love come from your heart, not fromyour hands. Holiness and submission and love are not thesame as good works, theyre elements of genuine faith. If your heart is full of sincere faith, itll also be fullof holiness and full of love toward God and youll lovesubmitting to Gods rulership. These things are notgood works, theyre elements of genuine faith in Christ!!
Let me repeat that were not saved through our good works.The Bible warns us that Israel, who pursued a law ofrighteousness, has not attained it. Whynot? Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were byworks.
We are saved when God influences our hearts toward voluntarysubmission to His rulership. Gods gracious influencesaves us and separates us from our deadly sins. Now thegood works that you do with your hands result from that, but ifyour heart isnt changed and you dont love God,pursuing good works is meaningless. May no theologicalcritic ever accuse me of preaching salvation by works.
No, I preach salvation by faith. Submitting your heart toGods rulership is the same as genuine faith. Repentanceand holiness of heart are the same as genuine faith. LovingGod with all your heart is the same as genuine faith. Ifyou dont repent and if your heart isnt holy and youdont submit to Gods rulership over your heart and youdont love God with your heart, mind, soul and strength, youdont have genuine faith. This isnt preachingsalvation by works, its preaching salvation by faith!
The Bible says, Everythingthat does not come from faith is sin
The Bible says, withoutfaith, it is impossible to please God.
Holiness, sinlessness, repentance, submission to authority, andfaith. These words all mean the same thing. Unholiness,unrepentance, sin, rebellion to authority, and unbelief. Thesewords also mean basically the same thing. Johnny, withoutholiness, you have no saving faith. Faith without holinessis not really faith at all.
Did you know savingfaith is also the same thing as loving God with all your heart?
Jesus gave us two commandments: Love God and Love Your Neighbor.
Faith cant express itself without love. The Biblesays The only thing that counts is faith expressing itselfthrough love.
Again, for youladies, what are the requirements of salvation? The Biblesays in 1 Tim 2, women will be saved
if they continue infaith, love and holiness.
So am I saying love a requirement for salvation? No, TheBible is. We know that we have passed from death tolife, because we love our brothers. Anyone who does not loveremains in death.
Again, how do you know if youre really saved and reallybeen born of God? The Bible says, Everyone who loves hasbeen born of God and knows God. Whoever does not love doesnot know God.
While werenot saved by good works; your heart change cant be genuineif good works dont result. The first requirement foreternal salvation is that you change your heart and repent. When your hearts genuinely changed, good works willnaturally follow. If youve really repented, itseasy to tell because your behavior changes too. But if yourheart never really changed, you can tell right away because yourdeeds remain evil too. This is how we knowwho the children of God are and who the children of the devilare: Anyone who does not do what is right is not a child of God;nor is anyone who does not love his brother.
Your lack of goodworks proves that your heart never really changed. Yourcontinual sin, seldom if ever broken by repentance, isconclusive, legally binding evidence that youve never beenborn again. The Bible says, No one who is born of Godwill continue to sin
he cannot go on sinning, because he hasbeen born of God.
Your evil works and sinful deeds prove youare not a child of God.
Lets stop and pray about this. If you can hear myvoice, stop what youre doing and lets get this rightbefore God. Pray these words along with me to God. Goahead and repeat after me. Father in heaven, Iconfess that my heart has never really changed. Itsobvious by my lack of good works, Lord, but the real problem isthat I need to get my heart right with you. Lord, I confessthat I have not lived a holy life, and I havent loved youwith all my heart. I am so sorry for that, Lord. Irepent, right now. I change the desires of my heart to makeyou my number one priority. I choose to love you Lord, evenmore than I love my own self. God, come and rule my heart,I pray in Jesus powerful name. Amen.
Did you pray with me just now? If you prayed with me, wouldyou say Amen? Go ahead, say it out loud. Amen, LordJesus. Some of you are receiving a physical healing in yourbody right now, as Gods loving rulership takes over in yourheart. I hope youll write to us and tell us aboutthat. But if you said Amen just now, whoever you are, Iwant you to write to us and get a copy of this book yourehearing me teach from. Ive been very fortunate andblessed to have this book read and endorsed by people like C.Peter Wagner, Tony Campolo, Jon Mark Ruthven who was mysystematic theology professor, Pastors Ted Haggard and FloydMcClung, Joy Dawson and Bill Hamon. So you know itstrustworthy. In our book and in future broadcasts,well answer the questions you may have about eternalsecurity or eternal salvation. And youll hear moretheological adventures of Johnny Lukewarm and Pastor Loophole. So I hope youll write us tune in again next time. NowI love you, and I care about you. So heres Mark withmore information.
Closing trailer by Mark McWilliams
Thanks Gordon, and thanks everybody forlistening. Do you know somebody who needs to hear todaysmessage? If you call our toll-free number in the next hour,866-Obey-God, well mail you a free cassette tape oftodays broadcast, which you can copy and give to yourfriends. All our tapes are copyable and free, but please rememberthat we need your donations to stay on the air and to give awaythese free tapes. So please pray and obey God about howmuch these teachings are worth to you, and return to us your bestpossible gift after you receive your free cassette. (Gordon: Hey time out! If its your first time contacting us,no donation is required! Just call us!) Our toll freenumber is 866-Obey-God, thats 1-866-O-B-E-Y-G-O-D,and please specify youre requesting todays program. Now do you believe
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