Program#L13—“The Theological Adventures of Johnny Lukewarm andPastor Loophole:  More Grace Loopholes (Cont’d)”

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Radio Show Transcript, © 2001, Persuade TheWorld Ministries, Gordon James Klingenschmitt, Servant.  Copyingand distribution (without editing) is highly encouraged. 

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Opening introduction by MarkMcWilliams…

Welcome and thank you for joining this radiobroadcast of Persuade The World Ministries.  You’reabout to hear our radio production of the book written and taughtby Gordon James Klingenschmitt, entitled “License To Sin,The Number One Reason America Is Losing Its MoralFoundation.”  If you call us in the next hour,we’ll mail you a free cassette tape of today’sbroadcast, which you can copy and give to your friends.  Justcall our toll-free phone number:  866-Obey-God.  That’stoll free, 1-866-O-B-E-Y-G-O-D.  Gordon James Klingenschmittis a graduate of the United States Air Force Academy, and aseminary graduate of Regent University, holding both M.B.A. andMaster of Divinity degrees.  He’s also the founder andservant of Persuade The World Ministries, a 501(c3) tax-exemptreligious non-profit corporation in Colorado Springs, dedicatedto persuading individuals in America and throughout the world toforsake their sins and submit their hearts and minds to theloving rulership of our Lord, Jesus Christ.  And now withtoday’s teaching, here is Gordon James Klingenschmitt. 

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Teaching by Gordon James Klingenschmitt

Thanks Mark.  Today we continue ourmini-drama entitled “The Theological Adventures of JohnnyLukewarm and Pastor Loophole.”  You remember ourcharacters: Johnny Lukewarm is a non-Christian who calls himselfa Christian.  He wants to go to heaven when he dies, butdoesn’t want to obey Jesus as the Lord of his life.  Sohe gets his advice from Pastor Loophole, who tells him everythinghis itching ears want to hear.

           (Higher) “Pastor Loophole, I’m very upset about thisparticular passage of scripture.  It seems as though God iscommanding me to do something I really don’t want to do. Do I really have to repent, and stop sinning, and obey God? Or is there some other alternative? 

           (Lower) “Why, certainly there is, Johnny Lukewarm, you justrelax.  I can offer you dozens of alternatives, and give youvery logical reasons why you don’t have to obey God.” 

           (Higher) “Oh, thank goodness.  For a minute there, Ithought I’d actually have to change my behavior and obeyGod!”  Johnny breathes a big sigh of relief.  Hesits forward eagerly, with his itching ears searching for someway of escape from the Holy Spirit’s conviction.  Butthe Spirit of God is grieved away, and He slowly withdraws hisconviction from Johnny’s life. 

 

Now let’s continue with Loophole #15,entitled “The Cross Plus Nothing” So here’s PastorLoophole again. 

           (Lower) “The Cross plus nothing, Johnny.  The bloodJesus shed on the cross is the only thing that can pay for yoursins.  And you can’t add one thing to the work Jesusdid for you on the cross.  When Jesus hung on the cross andsaid, ‘It is finished,’ [1] he meant that nothing else could be added tothat finished work.  So if you try to be holy, you’rejust adding to the finished work of the cross.  Yourholiness can’t atone for your sins, so it must not berequired for your salvation.  You don’t have to be holyto go to heaven.  Jesus did all the work that was required. There is only one requirement for salvation:  The Cross plusnothing.” 

 

TIME OUT !!  Let’s look at thescriptures everybody, and analyze Pastor Loophole’s advice. Let’s rightly divide the word of truth, and separate thetruth from the lies in the advice given by Pastor Loophole. First, I want to acknowledge the true part.  It’s truethat the blood Jesus shed on the cross is the ONLY thing that canatone for, or pay for, your sins.  So if you do live a holylife, your holiness doesn’t help atone for, or pay for, yoursins.  Who can wash away my sin?  Nothing but the bloodof Jesus.  Amen!  But just because the cross is theonly payment for your sins, that doesn’t mean it’s theonly requirement for salvation.  Payment is not the same asrequirement.  If the cross was the only requirement forsalvation, then everybody in all history would be saved, becausethe only requirement for everybody was already met!  Thecross is sufficient to atone for the sins of all mankind, but inreality it only covers the people who meet God’s otherrequirements.  If you don’t meet God’s otherrequirements for salvation, then what Jesus did on the crossdoesn’t apply to you.  

           For starters, the cross does not apply to you, if you refuse tobelieve in the Lord Jesus.  If the cross was the onlyrequirement for salvation, then faith in Christ is nota requirement for salvation. 

           (Lower) “Oh, well I meant to include that one.” saysPastor Loophole, “Just two requirements: The cross plusbelieving.  I didn’t really mean to say ‘the crossplus nothing.’ I meant to say ‘the cross plusbelieving.’  But certainly those are the only tworequirements for salvation.” 

           No, God has more requirements.  If the cross is the onlyrequirement for salvation, then receiving Jesus as your Savior isnot a requirement. 

           (Lower) “Oh yeah, I forgot—it’s the cross plus twothings.  The cross, plus believing and receiving Jesus asSavior.  But don’t add any more.  We don’twant to add to the finished work of the cross.” 

           No, God demands more.  If the cross was the only requirementfor salvation, then you don’t need to be born again. 

           (Lower) “Hmmm.” says Pastor Loophole.  “Iknow Jesus said ‘You must be born again,’[2] so I guess there are three things.  Believe,receive Jesus as Savior, and be born again.  O.K.  O.K. The cross plus three things.  But don’t add any more. We don’t want to add to the finished work of thecross.” 

           Sorry, here’s two more:  Paul writes that if youconfess with your mouth, ‘Jesus is Lord,’ and believein your heart that God raised him from the dead,[3] you will be saved. 

           (Lower) “Well, yeah, that’s in Romans 10.  O.K.,I’ll give you those two.  It’s the cross plus fivethings.”  But Pastor Loophole is starting to getfrustrated. 

           But here’s one more.  If the cross is the onlyrequirement for salvation, then repentance is not a requirement. But if you don’t have to repent, then why did all theprophets tell people to Repent and live! [4] Whydid John the Baptist preach repentance?[5]  Why did Jesusdemand repentance as the first way to enter the kingdom of God?[6]  And why did Peter preach, “Repent,then, and turn to God, so that your sins may be wiped out?”[7]  Why didn’t hesay, “you don’t have to repent, and your sins may bewiped out?”  Why did Paul preach repentance, and warnpeople to prove their repentance by their deeds? [8]  Because all thesepreachers knew, repentance is required, or the cross won’tatone for your sins! 

           (Lower) “No way.  That’s too much.”  PastorLoophole gets angry. “You can say the cross plus fivethings, but never six.  Now you’ve crossed the line. You’re adding way too much to the finished work of thecross.  I never liked the word ‘repent,’ anyway. Sounds like ‘salvation by works’ to me.” 

           But Pastor Loophole has drawn his line in the sand.  Firsthe said the ‘cross plus nothing,’ and then he conceded,‘the cross plus five things,’ but now he draws hisline, when all the prophets in the Bible requirerepentance.  Why does he stand against them?  Whatmakes him so uncomfortable?  What’s the realreason he says ‘the cross plus nothing?’  Does hewant to water down the gospel, and black out God’srequirement that we repent?  Why does he only like half theBible, and hate the other half?  Does he love his own sinstoo much to forsake them?  What liberal seminary taughtPastor Loophole his theology?  Who were his favorite Bibleteachers?  Did they work for God or for the devil?

           But wait, God requires more.  If the cross is the onlyrequirement of salvation, then you don’t have to confessyour known sins to God.  But the Bible says, If weconfess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us oursins...[9]

           (Lower) “Oh, stop adding to the finished work of thecross!” shouts Pastor Loophole. 

           Nope, I can’t delete God’s requirements from His Word. I’ll preach the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but thetruth.  I’d rather die than silence the half of theBible you don’t like.  But wait, here’s a few morerequirements: 

           John 17 says you must know Him, the only true God, and JesusChrist, whom he has sent.  This is eternal life.[10]  1st John 1 says if we walkin the light, as he is in the light…the blood of Jesus, hisSon, purifies us from all sin.[11] 1st John 2 says This is how we know we are in him: whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did.[12]  Hebrews 10 says if you deliberatelykeep on sinning, no sacrifice or atonement for your sins is left.[13]  Hebrews 12 says without holiness, noone will see the Lord.

Romans 8 says thosewho are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God.[14]  Revelation 3 says “To him whoovercomes, I will give the right to sit with me on mythrone.”[15] 

1st Corinthians 15 says “Bythis gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word Ipreached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain.”[16]  Revelation 2 says “Be faithful,even to the point of death, and I will give you the crown oflife.”[17]  If you don’tmeet all the Bible’s requirements for salvation, then youdon’t meet the Biblical requirements for salvation.  Lookthese up in your own Bible.  It’s not my list,it’s God’s. 

           (Higher) “But wait,” says Johnny Lukewarm, “Youjust read 16 New Testament requirements for salvation.  Butwhat if there’s more?  What if I overlook one, and Imiss heaven on a mere technicality?” 

           Relax, Johnny Lukewarm, because Jesus boiled all theserequirements down to only two.  If you just obey the twocommands of Christ, they’ll encompass all the otherrequirements in the Bible.  If you really want to be safe,read Luke chapter 10. 

An expert in thelaw stood up to test Jesus.  “Teacher,” he asked,“what must I do to inherit eternal life?”

           “What is written in the law?” he replied. “How doyou read it?”

           “He answered, ‘Love the Lord your God with all yourheart and with all your soul and with all your strength and withall your mind.’; and, ‘Love your neighbor asyourself.’”

           “You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied.  “Dothis and you will live.”[18]

           Oh my.  Did you hear what Jesus said?  All ofGod’s commandments can be summed up in these two:  LoveGod and love your neighbor.  Do this and you’ll inheriteternal life!  All of those requirements we read in theBible: believe in the Lord Jesus, receive Him as your personalSavior, be born again, confess with your mouth Jesus is Lord,believe in your heart God raised Him from the dead, repent andturn to God, confess your sins to God, know Him the only trueGod, and Jesus Christ, whom he has sent, walk in the light, as heis in the light, walk as Jesus did, don’t deliberately keepon sinning, be holy, be led by the Spirit of God, overcome sinand the world, hold firmly to the word that was preached to you,be faithful even to the point of death, all these commandments,and whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up inthis one rule: "Love your neighbor as yourself."  Nowwhen Jesus says in Luke 10, “love God with all your heart,and love your neighbor as yourself.  Do this and you willlive.”  What is he saying?  Is he adding to thefinished work of the cross?  No, he’s laying outGod’s requirements, if you want the cross to atone for yoursins!  Love God and love your neighbor.  Do this, andthe cross will atone for your sins!  Now holiness, or lovingGod and loving your neighbor, doesn’t atone for yoursins—only the blood Jesus shed on the cross can do that. But if you don’t love God and love your neighbor, then whatJesus did on the cross doesn’t apply to you.  Forgetabout ‘the cross plus nothing.’  It’s thecross plus love.  Love God and love your neighbor.  Dothis and you will live.[19] 

Read it foryourself in Luke 10.  Now let’s take a short break. 

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Middle segment by Mark McWilliams…

Thanks Gordon.  He’ll be back injust a moment.  But first, do you know somebody who needs tohear today’s message?  If you call our toll-free numberin the next hour, 866-Obey-God, we’ll mail you a freecassette tape of today’s broadcast, which you can copy andgive to your friends.  All our tapes are copyable and free,but please remember we need your donations to stay on the air andto give away these free tapes.  So please pray and obey,then send us your best possible donation, after you receive yourfree cassette.  (Gordon:  Hey time out!  Ifit’s your first time calling us, no donation is required! Just call us!)  Our toll free number is 866-Obey-God,that’s 1-866-O-B-E-Y-G-O-D.  And please specifyyou’re requesting today’s program.  Do you believeAmerica needs to hear these messages?  If so, then we needyou to sponsor us, by joining the Persuader’s Club with amonthly pledge of just $15.  If you join thePersuader’s Club, we’ll also send you an autographedcopy of Gordon’s book that you’ve been hearing.  Justvisit our web-site at persuaders-club.com.  Or call us inthe next hour at 866-Obey-God.  Right now, let’s returnto Gordon James Klingenschmitt. 

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Teaching continued by Gordon JamesKlingenschmitt

Thanks again, Mark.  Now let’scontinue with loophole number 16, entitled “positionalsanctification.”  Here’s Pastor Loophole again: 

           (Lower) “Now Johnny, holiness isn’t required for yourjustification, or eternal salvation.  No, holiness is onlyneeded for your sanctification, or your personal growth. 

And when we talkabout sanctification, there’s really two kinds: First,there’s ‘positional’ sanctification, and thenthere’s ‘actual’ sanctification.  Nowhere’s how it works, Johnny.  When you accept Jesus asyour Savior, you’re ‘positionally’ sanctified. You gain a position in Christ, so God pretends that you’reholy, even when you’re not.  Your position in Christ isall that matters, because God doesn’t look at those sins youkeep on enjoying, He only looks at what Jesus did for you on thecross.  Now once you’re ‘positionally’sanctified, you can take your sweet time about becoming actuallysanctified, or actually holy, because actual sanctification is alifelong process.  You have the rest of your life to grow inholiness.  You don’t have to be holy all at once, youcan do it gradually and slowly, because actual sanctification isa life-long process.  There’s no hurry, because actualholiness is optional when it comes to salvation.  Godalready sees you as positionally sanctified because of what Jesusdid for you on the cross.” 

           (Higher) “Wow, thanks Pastor Loophole,” says JohnnyLukewarm. “I guess I’ll just forsake my sins gradually,a little bit at a time.  I’ll give up some easy onesnow, but I think I’ll delay forsaking my favorite sins untillater on when it’s more convenient.  After all, actualsanctification is a life-long process.  And I’mpositionally sanctified until then.  I’m saved andgoing to heaven, even if I don’t give up all my sins, rightaway.” 

 

TIME OUT !! Let’s look at the scriptures everybody, and analyze PastorLoophole’s advice.  First, I want to acknowledge thetrue part.  It’s true that once you get saved,you’ll spend the rest of your life growing in knowledge, andit’s a life-long process to learn about what pleasesGod.  But the lie is that after you realizeyou’re walking in sin, you can take your sweet time andgradually forsake your known sins.  You can’t graduallyrepent, you’ve got to repent immediately!  God demandsyou forsake all your known sins immediately, not gradually. Yeah, you can gradually grow in knowledge, but repentance andholiness must be immediate!  You can’t delayrepentance, and wallow in your sins a while, and take your sweettime to become holy.  You’ve got to repent immediately! Not later on in life, right now!  Your knowledge will growgradually over time, but your actual holiness must be immediate. 

           Now the whole idea of “positional sanctification” is alie of the devil.  People who say you can be positionallysanctified are preaching the antinomian heresy, saying“without holiness, everyone can see the Lord.”  Theythink repentance is optional, and you can go to heaven withoutreal holiness, and Jesus died on the cross to forgive your sins,even while you continue to enjoy them.  But positionalsanctification is a false theological construct, and it’snot based on the Bible.  The Bible says without holiness, noone will see the Lord. 

So if you’rethinking, “I can gradually and slowly forsake my known sins,and I can delay repentance, and I can wait until later to get actuallysanctified.”  If you believe this, you believe the liesof the devil.  Only the devil wants you to delay repentance,and wallow in your sins a little while longer.  Don’tdo it.  God wants to set you free from your sins right now,not tomorrow. 

Repentance andholiness and sanctification aren’t optional, they’remandatory for salvation.  If you didn’t repent andchange your heart when you got saved, then you didn’t reallyget saved.  If you didn’t forsake your known sins, andstop sinning, when you got born again, then you didn’treally get born again.  1st John says, We knowthat anyone born of God does not continue to sin…No one whois born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remainsin him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God.[20] 

And Hebrews 10says, if we deliberately keep on sinning after we have receivedknowledge of the truth, no sacrifice (or atonement) for sins isleft, but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of ragingfire that will consume the enemies of God.  So if youdeliberately keep on sinning, you don’t have any atonement! What Jesus did on the cross doesn’t apply to you.  You’renot saved.  If you deliberately keep on sinning, your futureis in the raging fire and judgment that will consume the enemiesof God.  Read that for yourself in Hebrews chapter 10.  

 

Now let’s continue with loopholenumber 17, entitled “growing in grace.”  Here’sPastor Loophole again: 

           (Lower) “Johnny, we have to grow in grace.  TheBible says, grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord andSavior Jesus Christ.  Now growing in grace means thatyou forsake your sins gradually and slowly.  It takes timeto grow.  Don’t feel like you have to be holy all atonce.  Take your sweet time, and grow in grace.” 

 

TIME OUT !!  Let’s look at thescriptures.  It’s true that Christians grow in grace. But the lie is that growing in grace means you can slowly andgradually forsake your known sins.  Did you know that evenJesus grew in grace?  The Bible says Jesus grew in wisdomand stature, and in favor with God and men. [21] Now Jesus grew in favor with God—Jesus grew in grace.  Butthat doesn’t mean he slowly and gradually decided to obeyGod.  Jesus was holy immediately and consistently.  Sogrowing in grace doesn’t mean you gradually forsake yoursins. 

Charles Finney saidin 1840, “Many persons seem to understand the command‘Grow in grace,’ as implying that gradual giving up ofsin.....If growth in grace implies the gradual giving up of sin,then God has commanded men not to give up their sins atonce—they must give them up gradually.  The truth isthat growth in grace implies the immediate relinquishment of sinto begin with.”[22] 

 

Now let’s continue with loopholenumber 18, entitled “Our righteousness is like filthyrags…” Here’s Pastor Loophole again: 

           (Lower) “Johnny, you can’t be righteous in God’seyes, no matter what you do.  The Bible says, ‘allour righteous acts are like filthy rags’ [23]in God’s sight.  So no matter how holy you try to be,God only sees it as filthy rags.  And if your holiness cannever measure up to God’s standard, then it must not berequired!  Holiness can’t be required forsalvation.” 

 

TIME OUT !!  Let’s look at thescriptures everybody.  It’s true the Bible says, “allour righteousness acts are like filthy rags.”  Butthe lie is that if God changes your heart, and God fills yourheart with actual holiness, that’s also like filthy rags.But here’s the truth: there’s one kind of actual humanrighteousness which measures up to God’s standard—therighteousness which comes by faith.  With genuine faith(or whole-hearted submission to the Lordship of Christ) you canplease God.  But without faith it is impossible to pleaseGod.[24] When your heart is submitted to the Lordship of Christ, you can befound in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comesfrom the law [of Moses], but that which is through faithin [or submission to] Christ—the righteousness thatcomes from God and is by faith.[25]  Now when righteousness comes from God,and is by faith, does God view it as filthy rags?  No! If God himself changes your heart, and produces actual holinessin your heart, does God view it as filthy rags?  No! 

           (Lower) “But that’s just the righteousness of Christ,imputed to you while you continue to enjoy your sins,” saysPastor Loophole.  “It’s like you’re wearing aJesus mask.  You don’t have to be holy with youractions.”  But watch out for his lies, Johnny.  Donot let anyone lead you astray. He who does what is right isrighteous, just as he is righteous.[26] whosoeverdoes not righteousness is not of God,neither he that loves not his brother.[27]  The truth is there’s an actualrighteousness, initiated by God and acted out by holy people. And God doesn’t view it as filthy rags.  It’scalled genuine faith, and it’s pleasing to God, and itexpresses itself through love. 

 

Let’s pray for a moment.  Wouldyou just stop what you’re doing, and pray with me to God? Pray these words out loud, with me, to God:  “Father inHeaven, please cleanse my mind, and help me get rid of everyfalse loophole and excuse to remain in my sins.  I renounceevery argument against holiness, and I embrace your truth.  Iknow that sanctification must be immediate, and it’s notoptional.  I know I must love God with all my heart, andlove my neighbor as myself.  I know that growing in gracedoesn’t mean I can delay holiness, or gradually let go of mysins.  No Lord, I forsake them all immediately, right now.  Come and rule my heart, Lord, and fill me with genuinerighteousness.  In Jesus’ name, Amen.”

           Did you just pray with me?  If you prayed with me, would youraise your right hand up to God?  Wherever you are,it’s OK.  Just raise your right hand up to God, as asign that you prayed with me and gave your heart back to God. Some of you are receiving a physical healing in your bodies rightnow, as God’s forgiveness takes over in your heart.  Butif you prayed with me just now, I hope you’ll write to usand get a copy of this book you’re hearing me teach from. I’ve been very fortunate and blessed to have this book readand endorsed by people like C. Peter Wagner, and professors Tony Campoloand Jon Mark Ruthven, Pastors Ted Haggard and Floyd McClung, andJoy Dawson and Bill Hamon.  So you know it’strustworthy.  In our book and in our future broadcasts,we’ll answer the questions you may have about faith versusworks or eternal security, and you’ll hear more theologicaladventures of Johnny Lukewarm and Pastor Loophole.  So Ihope you’ll write us and tune in next time.  Now I loveyou, and I care about you.  So here’s Mark with moreinformation.

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Closing trailer by Mark McWilliams… 

Thanks Gordon, and thanks everybody forlistening. Do you know somebody who needs to hear today’smessage?  If you call our toll-free number in the next hour,866-Obey-God, we’ll mail you a free cassette tape oftoday’s broadcast, which you can copy and give to yourfriends. All our tapes are copyable and free, but please rememberthat we need your donations to stay on the air and to give awaythese free tapes.  So please pray and obey God about howmuch these teachings are worth to you, and return to us your bestpossible gift after you receive your free cassette.  (Gordon: Hey time out!  If it’s your first time contacting us,no donation is required!  Just call us!)  Our toll freenumber is 866-Obey-God, that’s 1-866-O-B-E-Y-G-O-D,and please specify you’re requesting today’s program. Now do you believe America needs to hear these messages?  Ifso, we’re specifically asking you to join thePersuader’s Club, and to sponsor this radio broadcast with amonthly pledge of just $15.  If you join thePersuader’s Club as a monthly partner, we’ll send youan autographed copy of the book you’ve been hearing, writtenand taught by Gordon James Klingenschmitt, entitled,“License To Sin, The Number One Reason America Is Losing ItsMoral Foundation.”  Just visit our web-site atpersuaders-club.com.  That’s persuaders-club.com. It’s the monthly donations of our Persuader’s Clubpartners who keep this program on the air.  Now if you havecomments or questions about today’s broadcast, you can emailus at  “persuadetheworld@yahoo.com,” Or you canwrite to us.  Or you can always call us toll free, at866-Obey-God.  And if you remember, please tell us the callsign of the radio station you’re listening to.  May Godbless you, and thank you for supporting Persuade The WorldMinistries.  Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, wepersuade men. 

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<Manymore transcripts and free MP3 radio shows CLICK HERE>



[1] John 19:30 (NIV)

[2] John 3:3 (NIV)

[3] See Romans 10:9

[4] See Ezekiel 18:32

[5] See John 3:2

[6] See Matthew 4:17

[7] Acts 3:19 (NIV)

[8] See Acts 26:20

[9] 1 John 1:9 (NIV)

[10] See John 17:3

[11] See 1 John 1:7

[12] See 1 John 2:6

[13] See Hebrews 10:26-27

[14] See Romans 8:5-17

[15] See Revelation 3:21

[16] See 1 Cor 15:2

[17] See Revelation 2:8

[18] Luke 10:27-28 (NIV)

[19] Luke 10:28 (NIV)

[20] I John 5:18, 3:9 (NIV)

[21] Luke 2:52 (NIV)

[22] Charles G. Finney, Principles ofSanctification, Ed. Louis Parkhurst, Jr.  (Bethany HousePublishers, Minneapolis, 1986), p.34.

[23] Isaiah 64:6 (NIV)

[24] Hebrews 11:6 (NIV)

[25] Phil 3:9 (NIV)

[26] 1 John 3:7 (NIV)

[27] 1 John 3:10 (KJV)